What occurs between the games? (Umineko Full Series Spoilers)

Will say it again before beginning, this has spoilers for all games potentially.
This is also why I cannot put this in a single game thread, because it concerns all of them.

The idea is as the title say. What occurs between games. I’m talking about the meta-world, obviously, and the meta-narrative. I suppose someone could talk about what occurs in “Rokkenjima prime” in between as well, tho that may warrant it’s own topic… or perhaps it is actually interrelated too much to separate, but that’s not what I’m bring up right now.

The idea in question came to me when thinking in particular of what occurs between game 1-2 and 4-5. I’m not entirely certain, to be honest that all that much occurs between the other games. In particular what strikes me there is how that topic seems to never have been addressed by fans. I’m specifically referring to a few things there.

Between arc1 and arc2.
In purgatorio at the end of arc1 characters suddenly talk about the events that occurred in a mostly 4th wall breaking POV. This is not only Battler and Beatrice, but the others as well. This kinda in itself brings into question what exactly is the meta world in relation to the game. Perhaps such a “stage” existed even before arc1, but from the way we’re presented, it’s sorta a follow up of arc 1. As if meta-Battler was “created” as the result of arc1. That may or may not be a good place to debate that concept I guess, within the idea of wondering wether there existed a “pre-game meta-event” that we haven’t seen in arc1 tho, and not under the idea of debating about the exact working of the meta-world (as there exists a thread for this already).
Still from the way arc1 ends, we don’t really know how Battler feels toward the “gameboard”, and the idea of it being a “gameboard” hasn’t been bought up yet. Still in arc2 it’s like there’s been definitively a missing “large event” where Beatrice somehow bought forward the idea of rebooting the world and having it follow a different direction while Battler and Beatrice are watching it and playing their game, after Battler being unable to resolve arc1. We don’t really know if Battler had a form of reaction or another (like “what you can reboot time? I won’t surrender to this”) or if the meta-Battler form the end of arc1 is already somehow consciously aware enough that this is all a fiction that he just kinda understand that this will be another tale. There’s also the entire matter of how this is presented as a “game” with a “gameboard” and moves, you’d think somehow Battler has gotten some form of explanation in a way or another as to what was going to occur (by which, I mean, them playing the game on another gameboard and the whole reset). In any case it seems pretty obvious to me that there’s a large part of stuff that is “missing” there, that occurred between meta-beatrice and meta-battler, and probably on purpose as it would reveal things we aren’t supposed to grasp, at the very least at that stage. Yet I feel like there’s never been much speculation as to what that missing time was.

This becomes far worst between arc4 and arc5 as well. To keep it as simple as possible, Battler is basically super pissed off at Ange’s death at the end of arc4 and is all “I’m going to beat you Beatrice and then go back home to my sister”. Then the end battle does brings up a sorta more “dere” event between them, but it shouldn’t have been (on what we saw at the very least) enough to overturn everything.
Then suddenly in arc5 Battler seems to have completely forgotten about Ange (this occurs pretty much all the time to be fair) and has lost all form of animosity toward Beatrice and rather is interested in understand her properly and getting angry at Bern and LD for trampling on their game.
Again this suggests a lot of time went by between the two games that are filled with a mental progression that lead to this state, and potentially figuring out a bunch of stuff. Heck afterward in arc 5’s end and arc 6’s end he never even considers the idea of “coming back to Ange” ever again, it’s like the entire idea vanished, but it had already pretty much vanished by the time arc5 began.

So again I guess I’m wondering if anyone has any speculation to do about what could fill these blanks. This may be valid for other arcs as well, at least those who follow the meta-narration of Battler, but I think again this probably concerns the two “blanks” I pointed out more then the others.

Anyone up to fill up this darkness with speculation, feel free.

3 Likes

Interesting idea for a topic!

This is very reminiscent of the ‘wrap parties’ (or whatever they were called) in Higurashi, where the characters of Higurashi did pretty much the same thing at the end of each arc. However, unlike in Umineko, these sessions aren’t canon in Higurashi, and also Umineko also takes a dark turn in the Tea Party that Higurashi obviously doesn’t

I guess maybe Ryukishi styled it after the Higurashi wrap parties either as a sort of easter egg, or to trick people into thinking it was going to be the same sort of meta world.

I think most people who read through the Umineko VNs got that impression, but in the manga it’s shown that MetaBattler and MetaBeatrice are the souls of PrimeBattler and PrimeSayo after their deaths (or partial death(?) in Battler’s case). I don’t know if that’s what Ryukishi intended all along, or if he made it that way later, but that could possibly be called the “pre-game meta-event.”

To be honest, the inconsistency of MetaBattler (especially his motivations) often makes it hard for me to identify with him as a protagonist. Like, I could understand if he wanted to destroy the illusion of the witch because he wanted to find out who really killed his family, but it seems he mostly wants to destroy it because… he’s just really thinks magic and witches are impossible.

If there were scenes filling in these gaps between arcs, that might have helped. But the fact that Ryukishi never created any Tips or anything to fill them in suggests that he didn’t think it was a problem.

Then again, Ryukishi has also said that he struggled with Battler’s characterization at first, so that might have something to do with it, too.

Most likely, how the first Tea Party starts is a combination of a shoutout to Higurashi and to completely shock Higurashi players that “HA HA IT’S NOT A FUN LITTLE BONUS THING YOU GET TO WATCH THEM DIE.”

I do agree that there is a lot of inconsistency with the end of EP4 Battler and the start of EP5 Battler. Like I guess we’re supposed to believe that by the start of EP4 (though where it went during the rest of the game up until Ange’s death is a mystery), Battler has begun caring enough about Beato that trying to kill her is supposed to hurt him even though he’s doing it to come home to Ange. This whole caring about Beato to where he doesn’t want to kill her but feels he has to really could have been developed a lot better if Ryukishi had shown them caring about each other in ways that aren’t “whoops trolled you too hard I should take it easy on you” and “Oops I kinda have to kill you now.” And the spaces between games like you said would have been perfect for it.

He seems to feel bad about killing her but he’s constantly flipping between I HAVE TO KILL HER and I WANT HER TO BE OKAY, and I agree, that’s what helped make me not like him (in addition to one awful person who role played him ruining him for me). Meta Battler’s characterization is so wishy washy and it’s annoying, to say the least.

But overall, I agree that there IS stuff that happens between the games that we aren’t shown (the closest might be the Game Master BATTLER TIP and I’m not sure if that even counts as canon). The Stakes seem to regularly interact with Battler, Beato tears down his theories (those seem to be what’s shown and implied to happen in the in between games of EP2 and 3 and 3 and 4, anyway.) I guess the person who is game master (with the exception of Lambda in EP5 who makes the game once she knows that Beato can’t make a game herself anymore) creates the game during that time, though I’m not sure on it?

But thank you for raising a really good point about the series. A friend and I are constantly going through series we like to view it from different viewpoints, and discovering things like this really is quite a welcome eye opener!

1 Like